“Rien ne justifie une telle tragédie”, affirme Stéphane Séjourné sur la situation humanitaire à Gaza

Cher Anthony, c'est avec un grand plaisir de te recevoir ici à Paris. La France, tu le sais, est profondément attachée à l'alliance qui l'unit avec les Etats-Unis d'Amérique dans le cadre de l'OTAN, dont nous célébrons d'ailleurs les 75e anniversaire et aussi dans le cadre, évidemment, de nos relations bilatérales. Pendant presque deux siècles et demi, nous avons toujours été ensemble de tous les combats avec les Etats-Unis d'Amérique pour la liberté. Les Etats-Unis savent ce qu'ils doivent à la France, mais je peux te dire très concrètement qu'ici en France, nous savons, la France sait ce qu'elle doit également aux Etats-Unis dans son histoire.

En ce 80e anniversaire également du débarquement, nous aurons d'ailleurs l'occasion de le redire avec force, notre amitié franco-américaine le 6 juin prochain sur les plages du débarquement. Et c'est dans cet esprit de liberté qui nous anime notamment, et c'est aussi cet même esprit de liberté qui nous a conduit à soutenir ensemble l'Ukraine. La Russie, vous le savez, mesdames et messieurs, mène depuis deux ans une agression injustifiable contre un pays libre et souverain, non content d'ailleurs d'opprimer son propre peuple. Vladimir Poutine veut soumettre le peuple ukrainien, mais deux obstacles aujourd'hui l'en empêchent depuis maintenant deux ans. D'abord, bien sûr, le courage.

On doit saluer ici des Ukrainiens qui, depuis maintenant deux ans, repoussent les assauts de l'armée russe. Leur combat est un combat de légitime défense, un droit, garanti d'ailleurs par la Charte des Nations Unies. Ce combat, il est juste et il faut systématiquement ici le rappeler. Ensuite, c'est la détermination des pays qui soutiennent l'Ukraine, notamment à maintenir son niveau de mobilisation dans la durée. La réunion ministérielle de l'OTAN à Bruxelles, d'ailleurs, doit demain être l'occasion pour nous d'intensifier notre soutien à Kiev et d'envoyer un signal très très clair de notre détermination à soutenir l'Ukraine dans la durée.

La conférence de Paris du 26 février était également une étape décisive en ce sens et nous mettons dorénavant en oeuvre les conclusions dans un certain nombre d'ailleurs de coalitions de pays couvrant les besoins des Ukrainiens. Avec les États-Unis, cher Anthony, nous co-présidons également la coalition sur l'artillerie dans laquelle nous poursuivons la mise en oeuvre d'une partie de nos initiatives. Pour affaiblir ce soutien, la Russie recourt également, et je l'ai dit souvent ici en conférence de presse, aux mensonges et à la manipulation de nos opinions publiques.

Je sais qu'elle finance notamment des ingérences, promeut des faux médias, accuse l'Ukraine et l'Europe de crimes commis par d'autres. Dernièrement, Daesh, c'est d'ailleurs une manière assez grossière de masquer le fait que la Russie s'est trompée d'ennemi en négligeant le risque du terrorisme islamique sur son territoire. Nous serons d'ailleurs déterminés en Europe à contrer cette propagande et je vous le dis aujourd'hui, peut-être en guise également d'annonce, que la France proposera d'ailleurs prochainement un régime de sanctions dédiées à ceux qui soutiennent les entreprises de désinformation et de déstabilisation de notre pays et de l'ensemble des Européens.

C'est une discussion qu'il faut qu'on ait à 27, mais c'est une proposition française. Nous avons, cher Anthony, évidemment évoqué le Proche-Orient. Permettez-moi d'abord d'exprimer notre condamnation ferme à la frappe israélienne qui a conduit à la mort de sept humanitaires de l'ONG World World Central Kitchen. La protection du personnel humanitaire est un impératif moral et juridique auquel tout le monde doit se tenir. La situation, vous la connaissez, la situation humanitaire sur place est catastrophique et s'aggrave de jour en jour. Rien ne justifie d'ailleurs une telle tragédie.

Dans ce contexte, les décisions du Conseil de sécurité doivent être mises en œuvre, y compris la résolution 27-28 récemment adoptée. Que dit-elle ? Elle dit tout simplement que tous les otages doivent être libérés immédiatement et sans condition, qu'un cessez-le-feu immédiat et durable doit garantir la protection de tous les civils et l'entrée massive d'aides humanitaires. Et dans ce contexte, j'ai pu présenter également au secrétaire d'État les initiatives de la France au Conseil de sécurité.

Et je pense qu'il est possible de créer un consensus à New York sur la base d'une solution à deux États, sur une paix juste et durable entre Israéliens et Palestiniens, sur des garanties de sécurité de parts et d'autres. J'ai trouvé d'ailleurs constructif nos échanges, une approche constructive. Je continuerai dans les prochaines semaines, dans les prochains jours, à faire ce travail auprès des acteurs de la région et auprès également des membres du Conseil de sécurité, d'ailleurs qu'ils soient élus ou membres permanents. Nous devons également éviter l'escalade régionale. Je pense notamment au Liban.

Nous avons également évoqué cette question où la France a fait des propositions accueillies favorablement par les parties libanaises. Je continuerai également à parler à tous les acteurs qui sont intéressés. Tous les acteurs, y compris l'Iran, doivent s'abstenir de rechercher l'escalade. Nous avons également évoqué la guerre au Soudan, une des pires crises humanitaires au monde. Un an après, d'ailleurs, le début du conflit, nous organiserons à Paris, le 15 avril, une grande conférence humanitaire sur le Soudan, présidée par la France, l'Allemagne et l'Union européenne.

Nous devons nous mobiliser sur cette grande crise qui est clairement oubliée, à la fois des médias et des responsables politiques. Et je sais que je peux compter, en tout cas, sur l'investissement des États-Unis, cher Anthony, pour faire que cette conférence soit un succès au service des populations en détresse. Enfin, une autre crise qui préoccupe la France et les États-Unis au Caucase Sud. Nous avons réaffirmé notre attachement à l'intégrité territoriale de l'Arménie, aujourd'hui mise en cause par l'Azerbaïdjan.

Je veux redire ici ma préoccupation face à l'emballement et à la rhétorique azerbaïdjanaise, la multiplication des fausses informations émanant de Bakou et tendent d'ailleurs à imputer à l'Arménie la responsabilité d'une escalade qu'elle est peut-être la seule, aujourd'hui, à vouloir éviter dans cette partie du monde. Je vois d'ailleurs dans ces exercices de propagande beaucoup de similitudes avec ce que la Russie impose à l'Ukraine. Et je pense que nous devrions, cher Anthony, y être également très attentifs à six mois de la tenue de la COP29 à Bakou. Voilà, M. le Secrétaire d'État, pour cette courte introduction. Je me réjouis en tout cas de poursuivre ces échanges à Bruxelles demain.

Et dans les semaines qui viennent, nous avons encore tant à faire pour que les valeurs qui ont en réalité fait nos deux pays puissent prévaloir dans l'ensemble de la scène internationale. Chère Anthony, merci en tout cas de ces discussions. Je te cède la parole. Et encore une fois, merci de la qualité de nos échanges.

Merci. Je suis vraiment ravi, comme toujours, de me retrouver à Paris. Et je tiens, Stéphane, à te remercier pour cet accueil-ci chaleureux et, justement, une conversation importante et, je crois, très constructif. Si tu me permets, je vais continuer en anglais pour mes collègues. Et, as I just said, it's always wonderful to be back in Paris, but I especially wanted to thank my colleague and friend, Stéphane, for the incredibly warm welcome, but also the quality of the conversation that we had. He covered most of what we've talked about. Let me just add a couple of quick points of emphasis.

On Ukraine, we discussed the imperative of continuing to support Ukraine so that it can effectively defend itself against the ongoing Russian aggression. That's for today. But also to make sure, through the work that we're doing, to help Ukraine build a strong military for the future, to attract private sector investment so that it builds up its economy, and to continue to strengthen its democracy, in particular, by moving down the accession path toward the EU, we are ensuring that we will have a Ukraine that stands strongly on its own feet, militarily, economically, democratically. And that's the single best response to Putin's aggression.

France has been a remarkable leader in this effort, both in making sure that Ukraine has what it needs to defend itself, and also working to set it up for the long term. It's been a leader in burden-sharing. Billions donated in military and economic assistance to Ukraine, but also rallying other countries, using its leadership to bring others along. We also see this leadership in the enforcement of sanctions and export controls to limit Putin's war machine.

We are working day in, day out to effectively prevent the transfer of weapons and materials to Russia to fuel that war machine, to fuel its defense industrial base, including from Iran, from North Korea, and from China, something that we discussed today. This is not only a threat to Ukraine, it's actually a threat to European security as a whole. And so there's a strong interest on the part of France, on the part of all European countries, to do everything we can to prevent the ongoing bolstering of Russia's war machine. Part of our shared challenge, too, is making sure that we are continuing to build up and energize our defense industrial base.

Earlier today, I had a chance to tour a factory where munitions are being produced. These munitions, French munitions, American munitions, munitions coming from other parts of Europe and well beyond, have been absolutely essential in ensuring that Ukraine could stand up against the Russian onslaught. We have to build a stronger allied defense industrial base that's capable of meeting the challenges of today, but also future challenges. And that's also one of the reasons why it is essential that the United States Congress pass President Biden's supplemental budget request as soon as possible, indeed, when it returns from its recess.

That would further turbocharge our own defense industrial base while creating more good jobs in the United States. As Stéphane said, we also spent some time talking about the Middle East. We've been grateful for France's partnership on the crisis of the Middle East and, indeed, working together to prevent the conflict that we see in Gaza from spreading to other parts of the region. All of us agree on the need to get to the quickest possible ceasefire, to allow the release of hostages, to enable the surge and sustainment of humanitarian assistance.

As I mentioned, we're coordinating closely when it comes to Lebanon and trying to prevent any spread of the conflict there, finding a diplomatic way forward. We're also working together on creating a path to a more durable and lasting peace. with security guarantees and political guarantees for Israelis and Palestinians alike. Let me also reiterate what Stéphane said about the attack on the World Food Kitchen members. World Central Kitchen, excuse me. First, I can only say that, for so many of us, we extend our condolences to the loved ones, to the families, friends, the colleagues of those who lost their lives, as well as those who were injured.

I spoke to Jose Andras just about a week ago about the efforts that World Central Kitchen's engaged in in Gaza, as it is in many other conflict zones around the world, including in Ukraine. They have been doing extraordinary, brave work, day in, day out, and critical work to try to make sure that people in need get what they need, starting with the most basic thing of all, food to survive. The victims of yesterday's strike join a record number of humanitarian workers who have been killed in this particular conflict. They show the best of what humanity has to offer when the going really gets tough. They have to be protected.

We shouldn't have a situation where people who are simply trying to help their fellow human beings are themselves at grave risk. We've spoken directly to the Israeli government about this particular incident. We've urged a swift, a thorough, and impartial investigation to understand exactly what happened. And as we have throughout this conflict, we've impressed upon the Israelis the absolute imperative of doing more to protect innocent civilian lives, be they Palestinian children, women, and men, or be they aid workers, as well as to get more humanitarian assistance to more people more effectively.

Finally, let me just say that, as you heard from Stéphane, we touched on a number of other issues. I think what we see is an extraordinary convergence between France and the United States on the major challenges of our time. We're cooperating together to try to ensure a free and open Indo-Pacific. That means a region where countries are free to choose their own path and their own partners, where problems are dealt with openly, where rules are reached transparently and applied fairly, where goods, ideas, people flow freely and lawfully. We're proud partners in the Paris Climate Summit, including joint efforts to advance civil nuclear energy as a greener alternative.

Finally, let me just say how grateful we are as well to President Macron for his longstanding leadership on some of the most important cutting-edge issues of the day. For example, all of the issues attendant to cyberspace, uniting governments, private sector, civil society around rules of the road that reflect our shared values and our shared interests. It is, I think, very fitting that we are celebrating two landmark anniversaries this year. The 80th anniversary of the liberation that Stefan alluded to, as well as the 75th anniversary of NATO, the alliance, the defensive alliance that joins us together.

In fact, the 80th anniversary of the liberation is a good reminder of why we decided a few years after the end of World War II to come together in that defensive alliance, to help ensure that something like World War II would never happen again, to make clear that countries in the transatlantic space would look out for each other, have each other's backs, and in so doing, make it less likely that aggression would occur. So there's a lot to look forward to in the weeks and months ahead, even as we deal with the challenges of this moment, and I look forward to being back in France to do that. Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you very much. Could you please stand up, please? Of course. Don't drop the laptop, John. Sorry about this. Very disorganized over here. Mr. Secretary, as the leader of the U.S. Department that has approved the transfer of the vast majority of the Israeli bombs dropped in this conflict, do events like the bombing of the World Central Kitchen Convoy give you pause about continuing the flood of U.S. weapons into Israel? And a second question for both of you. Thank you, Secretary Blinken and Minister Sejone. There has been a rise of Ukrainian strikes on Russian oil refineries. The West is fairly united in saying these strikes are justified.

Do you think hitting these facilities is the right strategic approach for Ukraine? Thank you, Secretary Blinken. Thank you, John. Let me take the second question first. It has been our view and policy from day one, when it comes to Ukraine, to do everything we possibly can to help Ukraine defend itself against this Russian aggression. And at the same time, we have neither supported nor enabled strikes by Ukraine outside of its territory. With regard to arm transfers, look, I think it's very important to put this in its proper perspective and to understand what we're talking about.

First, we have a longstanding commitment to Israel's security and to helping ensure its ability to defend itself. That's been a policy from administration to administration, Republican, Democrat, back and forth. And indeed, that policy developed over many years, developed into successive agreements between the United States and Israel, long-duration agreements, 10 years in this case, to provide military assistance over that time frame to about $3 billion a year. That's the system that's in place and it's long been in place. These arms transfers, every single one, happens consistent with statutory and policy requirements.

That includes both informal and formal notifications to Congress, and it's what we do with every country with whom we have a defense relationship that involves the sale or transfer of arms. Now, the other important piece of context is this, with Israel, and this is also true with other countries, there are a number of open cases, open requests of previously notified cases, which have not been fully fulfilled or completed. In the case of Israel, for example, there are many requests that were made and were notified to Congress and agreed to that go back a decade or more. And it takes time, often, to produce the material or the weapons in question, the parts, et cetera.

These complex systems, simply put, can take years to actually allow us to fulfill the request and the agreement. So, many of the cases that you occasionally report on now underwent congressional review years ago and were notified years ago, well before the conflict in Gaza started. Isn't that more of a problem, though, because they were approved in a non-wartime context? Well, let me come to that, because, again, all of this context is very, very important. We, of course, also go out of our way to make sure that we're actually going above and beyond the law and what's required in briefing Congress. We go to the relevant oversight committees.

We make sure that they're aware of ongoing transfers above the statutory threshold, even ones that they've approved a long time ago. And even when there's no requirement that there be additional notice or additional approval of any kind. Now, we've been focused on trying to make sure that October 7th can never happen again. But having said that, the security relationship we have with Israel is not just about Gaza, Hamas, October 7th. It's also about the threats posed to Israel by Hezbollah, by Iran, by various other actors in the region, each one of which has vowed, one way or another, to try to destroy Israel.

So the weapons, the systems that Israel has sought to acquire, and, as I said, have been contracted in many cases over many, many years, go to self-defense. They go to deterrence, trying to avoid more conflicts. They go to replenishment of their supplies and their stocks. So that's the system that's in place, has been in place for a long time, and one that continues. Now, as to the conflict in Gaza, from day one, we have worked to impress upon Israel the imperative of protecting civilians, of adhering fully to internationally humanitarian law, to the law of armed conflict.

That is something that we are looking at and review on a regular basis, and that we're engaged with Israel on a regular basis, including as recently as yesterday when we met with, by video, with the Israeli delegation.

— Merci. Je vais être assez clair et direct, puisque, pour ce qui est des attaques ukrainiennes sur les raffineries russes, le sujet est presque sans commentaire de notre part. L'Ukraine agit en légitime défense, et nous considérons que c'est la Russie l'agresseur. Et dans ces conditions, il n'y a pas beaucoup d'autres commentaires à faire. Je crois que vous m'aurez compris.

— Une question de la presse française. — Bonjour. Delphine Tuitou de l'agence France Presse. J'ai une question concernant le raid israélien sur le consulat... La question s'adresse à vous deux, messieurs, s'il vous plaît, sur le consulat iranien à Damas. Je voulais savoir si vous redoutez une escalade dans la région. Et j'ai envie de poser la question, qui est presque en follow-up avec ce qui s'est passé à Gaza récemment. Est-ce qu'Israël a franchi des lignes rouges, d'après vous ? Et quelles seraient les lignes rouges, d'après vous, à Gaza ou ailleurs, concernant la façon dont agit Israël en ce moment ?

— Je commence ? — Oui, je t'en prie. — Bon. Pour être très clair, tout le sens de notre action depuis le début, et je crois que le secrétaire d'État est dans la même dynamique, est d'empêcher l'escalade régionale. Tout le sens de l'action est d'empêcher l'escalade régionale. Et il y a des acteurs qui cherchent d'évidence l'extension du conflit au nord Israël, en mer rouge. On en a discuté, on l'a déjà commenté beaucoup ici, dans les frappes contre les États-Unis, en Syrie ou en Irak, d'ailleurs. Et donc le risque d'embrasement est entièrement leur responsabilité. Voilà.

Donc moi, je n'ai pas y compris de qualification à faire, mais à vous dire que tout le sens de notre action est d'empêcher cette escalade, et que dans ce cadre-là, nous nous obtiendrons de qualifier ce qui s'est passé.

Et je ne peux que vous dire la même chose, c'est exactement la même approche. On travaille ensemble très étroitement, justement, pour éviter une escalade, que ce soit au Liban, que ce soit en Irak, que ce soit en Syrie, que ce soit la mer Rouge, au Yemen, etc. Et en ce qui concerne les frappes en Syrie, nous essayons de connaître les faits. Nous sommes en train d'apprendre exactement ce qui s'est passé, et nous continuons pour le savoir en détail. Mais nous aimerons tous les jours, ensemble, la France et les États-Unis, surtout au Liban, pour éviter qu'il y ait un conflit entre les parties.

Conflit, d'ailleurs, que nous sommes persuadés, ni les Israéliens, ni Hezbollah, ni le Liban désirent, et ni l'Iran. Nous allons prendre une autre question de la presse américaine. Thank you. Hi, Simon Lewis from Reuters. I just firstly wanted to come back to the issue of the World Central Kitchen workers, the seven workers who were killed by an Israeli strike. I had the honor of actually knowing one of them, Zomi Francom, and I can testify to her zest for life, kindness, and selflessness that we could see in the work that she was doing. You know, this morning, I've seen an image of her Australian passport covered in blood. It's quite striking.

Secretary Blinken, you've been warning for several months about the need for more humanitarian aid to get into Gaza. You recently talked about the near-famine conditions there. This is the reason why these World Central Kitchen workers were there. You've called for an investigation, but this isn't the first time that aid convoys have been hit. This isn't the first time that the Israelis have been taking action that's restricted aid, both going into the Gaza Strip and being distributed. So I really wanted to ask, are you going to do more if this continues, this has continued for months? You know, is there more than you can do than simply raise these issues with the Israelis?

And if their investigation comes back with certain findings, you know, is there some action that the United States, as the main backer of Israel, is going to take regarding that? And secondly, France has proposed a new UN Security Council resolution on Gaza that goes further than the one that the U.S. abstained on last month, calls for decisive and irreversible measures taken by parties towards a two-state solution. Secretary Blinken, you've called for a pathway to a two-state solution, a Palestinian state. So will you support such a resolution? And to the foreign minister, regarding that resolution, are you assured of having U.S. support for that? The U.S.

has used its veto several times since October to block resolutions on Gaza. So would you call on Secretary Blinken to not use the veto in this case? Thank you. Thank you, sir. Simon, with regard to humanitarian assistance, going back to the very first trip that I made to Israel after October 7th, a few days later, in every trip subsequent to that, I and many others, starting with President Biden, have worked to impress upon Israel the moral, the strategic, the legal imperative of doing everything possible to provide humanitarian assistance to people who need it.

And, of course, we've seen Israel take important steps over the last six or so months, whether it was opening Kerem Shalom, whether it was actually starting by opening the Rafa crossing to begin to allow assistance in. Kerem Shalom, guaranteed fuel deliveries, flower through the Ashdod port, opening a new gate, 96 gate, just a couple of weeks ago, now the maritime corridor that many of us are working to establish. They've taken steps. But it is, simply put, insufficient. It is not enough to meet the needs of the children, the women, the men in Gaza who remain caught in a horrific crossfire of Hamas's making.

So in our conversations with the Israeli government, including just last week when the defense minister was in Washington, and just yesterday when we were on a videoconference with Israeli counterparts, we impressed, again, upon them the imperative of now surging and sustaining assistance. And not only getting it into Gaza, but within Gaza, getting it to everyone who needs it, including in the north, where, as you know, the conditions are the most challenged, and where World Central Kitchen was laboring to get assistance to people.

So we and many others, including France, are intensely focused on this, and we are looking very carefully to see the necessary steps are taken to ensure that the assistance needed gets in and gets to people who need it. This also involves issues like much better coordination on the ground. We'll see what the investigation of the incident with World Central Kitchen reveals. But coordination has been a perennial problem, deconfliction, as well as other challenges, destroyed roads, lack of trucks within Gaza, things of that nature that have to be remedied, as well as the access points into Gaza.

Having said all of that, I'm not going to get into hypotheticals or get ahead of myself or get ahead of the administration. All I can tell you is this is an area of intense focus and absolute necessity. When it comes to the Security Council, France and the United States work very closely together as permanent members on pretty much every issue that comes before the Council, including this one. And I look forward in the days and weeks ahead to talking about the current effort, other efforts that may come forward. We share the same objectives.

I think, based on my conversations with Stéphane, I think we both agree that getting an immediate ceasefire to enable the release of hostages and the surging of humanitarian assistance would be the best next step that we could have to actually really change things on the ground. So we want to make sure that we're maximizing the efforts to do that. Negotiations with regard to a ceasefire and hostages are ongoing. We also agree that we have to find a path to a durable, lasting peace for Palestinians and Israelis alike. And we both agree that, ultimately, that has to include the establishment of a Palestinian state with necessary security guarantees for Israel.

So we're aligned on the fundamentals, and we'll be talking in the days and weeks ahead about any of the measures that are before the Council.

Yes, of our side, we have already salued, the last week, the adoption of the resolution. And we call, by the way, the parties to respect the content. If there is no respect for content, there is no more international law and there is no more regulation multilateral. The France is also, and you mentioned it, initiative to work at the Security Council, with its partners, including the United States, on the parameters of this crisis, including the political parameters. There are several places where we talk about the political parameters.

In a certain number of circles diplomatically, we build around the solution, and, of course, the two states, the entire system, which could be the way to déboucher on the political crisis, but accompanied, effectively, of a cessation-feu, of the entry of humanitaries and a political system, which allows us to guarantee the security of part and other. And then, we also discussed with the Secretary of State, and it was also the sense of my visit in Egypt with my homologues Egyptian Jordanian. It was also a part of the visit that I made to Guyana, who is also an elected member of the Security Council of the United Nations, on its perimeter, of the crisis and an eventual resolution.

To all you say, we are going to continue to concert the whole members of the Council, and more large, I think, the countries that are in the region, and we have to be able, and it is our intuition and our certitude to find a consensus which is the most large possible, around the sortie of crisis durables. That must pass by a new resolution. That will pass by a new resolution. There may be another biais, there may be another, but in any case, I think that it is the responsibility of France to enter this solution.

We will take a last question for the French press. Thank you, Philippe Ricard, for the Journal of the Monde. A propos de l'Ukraine, I would like to know if the points of view between France and the United States were approached on the possible invitation of the Ukraine to join a day of the OTAN. Is it that you have discussed today, in prelude, of course, at Washington in July? And then, a little question about the Iran vis-à-vis Ukraine. Is it that, on a regard of the inquietude of the Western authorities about the delivery of missiles iranians to Russia, in the conflict in Ukraine, where are you? What are the information you have on this subject?

Thank you. As we have said, at the summit of Vilnius, but I think that we share this point. The NATO members of the OTAN are engaged to support the reforms of Ukraine in the way of the integration, of course, to the OTAN. And we must, of course, work on this summit of the OTAN, as well as the unity. And I think that it is important. I think that France and the United States are attached to this unity on this subject. And so, in the next hours, in the next days, I think that we will confirm a unity of the OTAN countries around this formula, which should remain the same, that of Vilnius.

Indeed, we have discussed a little bit the summit of the OTAN and Ukraine, but we will talk a lot more in detail that, in the days that come, in Brussels, during the meeting of the international affairs of the OTAN, as the allies have said to Vilnius, Ukraine will be a member of the OTAN. and, for us, it is a question of having a very good and very clear leaflet of route to achieve this conclusion. And I think that the summit of the OTAN, the 75th anniversary of the OTAN, will, in fact, be very concentrated on, in a very concrete way, how to establish this leaflet of route, or to use our image, the bridge necessary for the Ukraine as a member of the OTAN.

And in terms of the missiles coming from Iran, which arrive in Russia and are used against the Ukrainian people, and, in fact, we have discussed it. We work together to try to interrupt or, otherwise, to penalize all the support of this type of support, whether from Iran, from the North or other, including China. And it is also something that we will talk about, with our colleagues of the OTAN in the future. Thank you, Mr. Minister. This question concludes the press conference. Thank you for your participation. I hope you enjoyed this video.

Thank you. Thank you.